Buffy Season 1: Any Spoilers in Special Features? (1 Viewer)

[Paul_Scott]

hmmm.
if you feel that way about S6, i'm going to be very interested in reading your thoughts on S7.


i won't belabour the point that this particular material doesn't hit us the same way. if i had to guess i would say the majority of Buffy fans felt as you did about the season, though i do remember hearing some say that watching them on dvd in quick succession helped alleviate some of the problems they originally had.

fwiw, watched the first two eps of Firefly and if i had more time i would have watched at least one more. and this is a show that i had resisted for the longest time. if it wasn't for the upcoming film and the almost universal praise i see for it, i would have kept right on walking.
in other words, Angel is definitely in my sights for later on.

 

[Chuck Mayer]

Paul,
You won't regret Angel. The first season is slow to start, and is basically one long set-up. It really hits it's stride in S2.

I also have Firefly on my shelf, but I need to get my wife interested. She wasn't thrilled with the pilot (but nor was she for Buffy and Angel, she resisted Angel for about 10 episodes - none of which were bad).

To give you a better runthrough of S6, I'd have to watch it again. I distinctly remember one major gripe I had. Willow had whatever powers the writers needed her to have at that moment. It was very inconsistent. A good writer would have structured her powers initially (even if only to themselves), let the audience know what they were over an episode or two, and then STICK with them. That would require creativity, though. Any other criticisms exist in other Buffy threads. I'd have to dig them up.

Take care,
Chuck

 

[Eddy-C]

If you thought the lack of new sets in Buffy Season 6 is bad you ain't seen nothing yet. Season 7 for me was the most castrophobic year ever.


Heh, EVERYONE who was on Buffy is a better character when they got away from the hellmouth.

 

[Kevin Grey]

Yeah, its hard to believe that the Wesley in action in "Apocalypse Nowish" was the same guy who showed up halfway through Buffy Season 3. That's one of the reasons I loved the Angel ep "Spin the Bottle"- Whedon tailor it made it to make it clear just how far everyone had come along.

 

[Kevin Grey]

Also to jump on the getting Paul to watch Angel bandwagon- Season One is definitely much weaker. It was very obvious that they had trouble finding the tone for a while. At the beginning it came off as a lower-rent X-files with all of the unused concepts Carter and Co had cast off. Luckily the characters and humor were generally strong even in the episodes with the dumbest concepts.

About halfway through it starts to find its footing and the last five episodes are pretty stellar.

Thinking back on Angel S1 the most frustrating part was all of the scenes with Angel almost in sunlight. I think Whedon blamed it on a new crew but you would think that people wouldn't forget that he was a vampire. Luckily that was fixed in short order.

EDIT- Angel S1 also suffers from the (probably correct) assumption that they would be getting viewers who had never watched Buffy. Consequently there is a lot of exposition and plot points revolving around getting new viewers caught up on Angel, the nature of his soul, relationship with Buffy, etc.

 

[Holadem]

Very well said.

Most of the characters in Angel, have shown some serious and often costly ruthlesness at some point and they were almost always themselves, and entirely responsible for their actions. Like Angel in the season 2 ep Reunion, one of the few Angel episodes I remember by name (the serialized nature of the show makes it difficult to pin point individual eps). There are other such examples.

When conflict erupts between characters on Angel, one can never feel safe in knowing that it will all end with a hug and handshake. That's very rare on TV.

Kevin, I don't believe you mentioned the Buffy-Spike thing, I am curious to read your impressions .

S6 was also hurt by the prolonged absense of Giles, although his return was one of the best moments of the season.

I enjoyed S7 of Buffy, but the story could have been told in half the time.

Paul, drop everything you're doing and go watch Angel immediately.

--
H

 

[Wendy_L]

Cool! I should have that disc waiting for me when I get home today. It should of been there yesterday but for some reason it wasn't. I was very annoyed. That disc also has "Spin the Bottle" on it which sounds like another good episode. I can't wait to watch them now.

Kevin: I'm so sorry how disappointed you were in BtVS S6. I also thought the "Disc 3 Trio" were lame episodes but after that it picked up for me again and I enjoyed it. I guess I'm a very simple TV watcher...as long as I am not bored, I'm happy. If I'm watching an episode and I fidit alot then I know it's not to my liking. But if I don't fidit then I know it has caught my attention enough to stay focused. That's how I judge what is a good and a not-so-good episode (since no episode was ever bad for me). I know, real techinal, huh?

I will also be interested in your comments for S7. That definitely wasn't one of my favorite seasons but it did have some memorable episodes in it for me.

Paul: YES, watch "Angel". Took me a little bit to get into it also but now I'm really glad I did. There are some excellent episodes in S1 too. Actually, some of my favorites of the series so far.

RE: Firefly. I watched the first disc and wasn't overly impressed. I put the rest of the discs on the back burner for right now so I could get caught up on a few other series. I'll watch them right before I go see the movie.

 

[Ric Easton]

Hey Cuz,

You really should give Firefly another shot. I thought Joss really hit the ground running with this show. The cast seemed to have a great chemistry from the start and most of the characters were already fully realized. It was a real shame that this show was treated like crap by FOX and got cancelled way before its time.

As much as I loved Angel and liked Buffy (Hey, how much teen angst can I take?), I really think this had a real shot at being his best series.

The wife and I are looking forward to the movie, but thare are things you can do with a series (ie: character development) that you just can't touch with a feature film.

Ric

 

[Kevin Grey]

In general I'm "okay" with it. I think the show had done an outstanding job of building Spike's character toward this since the beginning of Season 5. On the Buffy side of things, I understand why Buffy got involved with him but I don't think that SMG completely sold the emotional state that would drive her to Spike. Still, I "get" what the writers were going for here and accept it.

The whole attempted rape thing is a bit bothersome. I gather this was a rather controversial issue at the time. In some ways I like it (wow, does that sound bizarre out of context) because it illustrates how the lack of a soul can easily lead to such a horrific act. I appreciated it in particular because just prior to that stage Spike was generally so "good" in his actions that it was hard to discern what differentiated him from Angel.

My issues with the attempted rape are that it feels like it was given rather short-shrift by the rest of the Scooby's. Its understandable to an extent since it occurs in the same episode with Buffy and Tara being shot. With Tara dead and Willow on the rampage its easy to see how it wasn't a focal point anymore. However, this issue really needed some space devoted to it and would probably have been better served if it had been moved up an episode or two. It also demonstrated another problem with the lack of consequences I mentioned earlier- despite what Spike did, Buffy was ready to send Dawn to him for safety in the very next episode. I found that rather bizarre and inconsistent.

 

[MattWel]

I agree with your overall opinion of Season 6, KG. I never did watch the show during it's broadcast run but on a friend's advice I started watching on dvd. I started season 1 and from there I devoured seasons 1-6 in a very short amount of time. I enjoyed every season very much (with some containing some episodes that are as good as any television I have ever watched) up until season 6. Season 6 left me so disappointed that I still haven't watched Season 7 yet even though I tore through the first 6 seasons. I guess I just don't care given what has happened to Xander's character, the Evil Willow/drug metaphor, and the Buffy/Spike thing. I didn't like any of it. While watching the last half of Season 2(the show's peak IMHO) and Season 3 I could't not imagine someone wanting a show this good shortened at all, like the people who said the series should have ended at the end of Season 5. I must admit I feel differently now.

 

[Wendy_L]

Did anyone else find that disturbing?

 

[Eddy-C]

You're supposed to find that disturbing.

 

[Kevin Grey]

Definitely.

Agreed on Habeus Corpus too- another great episode.

 

[Jay_B!]

I think talking to a friend, I think I understand why I was never a big Angel fan while I could never get sick of Buffy. Because I notice the general consensus here is "Buffy's an alright show, but Angel, that's freaking brilliant!"

Angel is all-in-all, a "man's show". Buffy is more a "female empowerment show". I frankly tend to gravitate more towards "chick" shows. If you notice, the "Angel is better than Buffy" crowd are generally men. I'm a gay man, I've always been drawn more into shows like Charmed, Roseanne, The Golden Girls, Sex And The City, Popular, The Facts Of Life, etc... as opposed to standard "testosterone fest" programs like The A-Team, Home Improvement, Star Trek, etc.... (even though I have always loved Seinfeld and Taxi, two "masculine" shows with one token female character each). So this could possibly be a reason I have always preferred Buffy to Angel 100 to 1.

 

[Scott_F_S]

I don't really buy that that's the reason. I think it's a question of consistency. Both shows are brilliant, but Angel was much more consistent and was the work of a more experienced, established creative team. Where Buffy tended to lose its direction sometimes, especially in the later years, Angel never really lost its focus.

 

[Paul_Scott]

the only season where i felt Buffy lacked direction or had a 'let's throw a bunch of stuff at the wall and see what sticks' quality was the last one.
but even so i still greatly enjoyed it- some of the cliffhangers, especially knowing that this was the last season and anything could happen, made me honestly jump out of my seat.
it wasn't a great season in the larger scheme, but i still had a ripping good time.

as far as why i probably prefer Buffy and have a harder time getting enthused by Angel- i'm a perv. i love oogling so many cute babes.

 

[Citizen87645]

I thought Angel had plenty of that going too - so are you saying you prefer teenagers???

 

[Jay_B!]

. Technically though, Angel is as much a "guys show" as Buffy is a "girls show". Usually your preference will gravitate you to what you like more. Chances are, if you like The Golden Girls more than Home Improvement, you're going to prefer Buffy (at least I notice with women and gay men I know), if you prefer The A-Team to Charmed, you'll probably prefer Angel.

 

[Paul_Scott]

i hate:
Home Improvment
The A-Team
Miami Vice
3rd Rock From The Sun
Magnum PI

i was kinda worried that i might be gay and supressing it, but then i realized i also hate:

Golden Girls
Charmed
The Nanny
Sex & The City
Will & Grace

whew.
felt like i just dodged a bullet

seriously, when i was in my late teens, i was very conscious of what pop culture material i aligned myself with, because having a fondness for something that my peers considered 'uncool' would be enough to begin the process of ostrization. probably the only benefit to getting older is i find i care less and less as to what other people think (about what i like).

for me Buffy was always a well written, witty, and (usually)emotionally affecting show. it may have had the horror veneer, but at its core its comic book superhero material, which is something i have always loved.
and it was genuinely funny. Angel seemed to take itself more seriously and i guess that made it seem less fun.
that was just my snap judgment. i'll give it a fairer evaluation eventually.

i'm just about at the end of Firefly, and while that can be entertaining too, and funny- i've found it far less involving than Buffy. for one thing theres a strong feeling of the show 'resetting' itself every episode. people get shot and stabbed and violently tortured , and then the very next ep people are walking around as happy as you please. had the show continued it probably would have only got better and more involving, but as it is it rates only a laid back thumbs up from me.

 

[Robert Ringwald]

Firefly also has a different episode structure. For example, considering they are going through space and travel like that takes a while, certain episodes could have as much as a month's time between them.

I seem to recall Mal mentioning that it had been half a year from episode 7 (Our Mrs. Reynolds) to episode 14 (Trash).

So it's understandable that people who had been shot could have healed in between episodes.