best site for international Twilight Time purchases? (1 Viewer)

[Jari K]

"In Europe it's always been illegal under the EU Copyright Directive to manufacture region free DVD or Blu-ray players."Link, please? Since I don't believe that's true.With most of the DVD players, these region restrictions were done in the software level. So they didn't really "manufacture" region coded players. There were always some tricks (often via remote, so it was simple) to get the player region free. I've done it many times (Sony, Panasonic, etc) back in the days. Sometimes they did it for you in the store!With BD players the region coding is not that simple to remove, but I highly doubt that it's "illegal". Like I said earlier, region coding is there because of the bigger studios/licensors. It isn't there to prevent piratism or something like that.

 

[Douglas R]

"In Europe it's always been illegal under the EU Copyright Directive to manufacture region free DVD or Blu-ray players."Link, please? Since I don't believe that's true.

This is a link to the EU Directive. Click on EN for the English version;
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:32001L0029:EN:NOT

Wiki gives a brief summary of Directive - see "Technological protection measures".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Directive

 

[Jari K]

I have no trouble of sleeping so I don't read all of it. Any particular sections you could copy&paste?At the end of the day my point is what the consumer is doing with these players and many people are scared when the words such as "illegal" are thrown in the forums. All players are usually region coded to certain areas (few are "R0" from the box), but that doesn't mean that owning a "region free" player is illegal or something like that.But yeah, with the BD players things are more complicated now. I guess you need go to the "hardware" level (?) in many players to override the region coding and that is not everyone's cup of tea. Back in the DVD days you pressed certain combination from your remote and that was it. At least with certain models (not all of them).

 

[Douglas R]

At the end of the day my point is what the consumer is doing with these players and many people are scared when the words such as "illegal" are thrown in the forums. All players are usually region coded to certain areas (few are "R0" from the box), but that doesn't mean that owning a "region free" player is illegal or something like that.

I never suggested that ownership of a region free player was illegal and of course the legislation only impacts on areas of sale and manufacture. I'm not an expert in this matter but clearly the amount of region free players available indicates that not much (if any) enforcement is done, although it might be a different matter if the major manufacturers sold region free players straight out of the box and advertised them as such.

 

[Persianimmortal]

In Europe it's always been illegal under the EU Copyright Directive to manufacture region free DVD or Blu-ray players. Although hacked or grey region free players can be found from specialist dealers and the internet, the major manufacturers, Sony, Panasonic etc do not make such players. Under pressure from American film studios, I imagine other countries must have similar legislation.

From the material you linked to Douglas, it's still not clear whether bypassing region coding is illegal in Europe. The entire issue, both in Europe, and in Australia, revolves around whether region coding has been proven by law to be a "Technological Protection Measure" (TPM). A TPM seems more to be a specific reference to copy protection measures, rather than region coding, which as noted earlier has nothing directly to do with copy protection. I also referred earlier to the TPM clause in the DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act), and although the European legislation may be more strict, it still seems to hinge on whether region coding is a TPM. Which is why I think the whole thing still needs to be tested in a court of law, and both sides seem wary of doing so due to cost and the potential for a disastrous loss.

One thing seems certain: even if making region free players was proven to be 100% legal, the manufacturers have no incentive to do so because they want to keep the content providers happy. Which means the push to remove region coding needs to come from the studios.

Most region A locked titles eventually get a B release, & with German & French releases, I'm sure we do better with catalogue releases in Europe than they do in America!

It's true to say that 95% of the movies I want have come out in Region B or Region Free form. But unfortunately, as more and more studios farm out their releases to the smaller companies like Olive and Shout! Factory, which region lock all of their releases, I thought it was time to go region free with my player.

For example, I got tired of waiting for Sweet Smell of Success, released by Criterion on BD in 2011, to come out in Region B. Similarly, recently, the Gatchaman Collection, a childhood favorite cartoon series of mine, was released only in Region A locked form and I doubt its limited appeal in Europe will see a Region B release of this large and expensive set anytime soon. Olive's Film Noir Collection is also unlikely to see a similar collection released in Region B (although one or two of its individual films will undoubtedly come out in Region B). And frankly, I also got tired of having to wait for reviews/user confirmation of region coding before being able to order any disc with confidence.

 

[AnthonyClarke]

I wrote a submission quite some years back to the Federal Government arguing the case for legal sale of region-free DVD players, using an educational argument for students and institutions ... pointing to the (then) couple of thousand DVD titles on sale here in Australia compared to the scores of thousands available in the States. I was told later by Government sources that my submission was a critical one in getting specific exemption here for legal manufacture and sale of region-free machines.
It's only on the introduction of Blu ray players and enforcement of the latest 'Free' Trade Agreement that things have tightened up again. Maybe if all manufacturers flouted the regulations, nothing would be done ... though under our new governmnet, nothing is predicable ....
Cheers all

 

[Doug Bull]

Phew!
I'm beginning to think my ongoing commitment to buy separate players for separate regions was the way to go after all.

Doug.

 

[Jari K]

I never suggested that ownership of a region free player was illegal and of course the legislation only impacts on areas of sale and manufacture.

Yes, understood. It's true that even in the "DVD days" most players (if not all) were region coded "from the box". But it was pretty easy to override the region coding.

Phew!
I'm beginning to think my ongoing commitment to buy separate players for separate regions was the way to go after all.

That is my decision (Region A & B) for the BD region codes. Usually BD players are kinda "slim" so these players don't take much space from the A/V rack.

 

[AnthonyClarke]

I'm still happy with my Oppo .. it's so simple to switch regions and the playback can't be bettered, though possibly equalled by others..

 

[bettyblue]

I actually import all my Blu rays from the US for one particular reason... the cover art. In Australia, we have those hideous big classification logos slathered on the cover and it partially obscures the art work. I don't care what my film is classified, I'm have enough wit to judge the content of a film from the blurb, poster and general word of mouth around the film. No mother is going to pick up something in the thriller section thinking it's suitable for her 6 year old. The general public of Aus isn't that stupid, certainly not as stupid as the Australian Classification Board seems to think we are (no, we don't need that much guidance). I don't remember these big rating symbols in the early days of home video. It's totally frustrating. Even the UK has much smaller boxes for the classification and no vague description of the content ("high level blah blah blah").


It's got to change. They could make reversible covers, shrink wrap Blu rays WITH the rating on the plastic therefore once purchased, wrapping is removed and it's just the clean cover art without any classification nonsense. Or it could easily go on the back, where I don't have to see it as soon as I pick it up. They are an eye sore. I know it may seem incidental but I'm not just paying for the film presentation or the disc, but the packaging too. On a similar note, I've never seen any titles released here with art work on par with Criterion, Twilight Time or Shout Factory etc.

 

[ROclockCK]

All good advice about bundling Twilight Time titles to save on total shipping. But doing so provides another significant benefit: with at least 3 items, SAE will ship it all in a nice sturdy well-padded box. I have never had a trace even peripheral damage to any 3+ boxed SAE order...even when drop-kicked around the Canuck postal system.


BTW Anthony, if you're in an epic mood, and Khartoum isn't your cup o' jo*, then have you considered Solomon and Sheba? Like Khartoum, this is another large format MGM transfer which wasn't merely "squint and it's okay". That Technirama picture has never looked or sounded remotely this good on home video. IMO, a woefully underappreciated release from this label.


* ...although it's definitely the reel deal: in full 2.76:1 UltraPanavision with a superb counterpart commentary to the British colonial war discussion on the Zulu yack track.