AVM-20 and Parasound combo...Interconnects?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Paul Gere, Mar 21, 2003.

  1. Paul Gere

    Paul Gere Second Unit

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    If you're reading this, you probably have a an AVM-20 paired with a Parasound amp. That's the setup I've got and I'm wondering about interconnects between the two. Currently, I'm using Analysis Plus Copper Ovals and the sound is pleasing, but I'd prefer an equally smooth connection and broad soundstage with slightly more high end presence/air. IF it helps, all seven of my speakers are Paradigm Studio Reference.

    What IC's are you using in your AVM-20/Parasound combo? What do you recommend for me?

    Thanks,
    -Paul
     
  2. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    what you're asking for out of an interconnect just isn't possible. virtually every interconnect is flat to well beyond the limits of human audibility and the only electrical specification that means anything is capacitance. as your distance increases, or were you to use a passive preamp, then you'd be looking towards low capacitance cables.
    if you're looking towards enhancing your soundstage, i'd start with experimenting with speaker placements combined with a critical examination of your room in order to deal with reflections.
    air...jeez, what is air...some attribute it to tubes. go to guitar center and pick up a Behringer Ultra Q and stick it between your two units. then you can either bypass the tubes or variably increase their interaction. it's an analog unit and comes with parametric equalizaiton.
     
  3. Paul Gere

    Paul Gere Second Unit

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    Chu,
    ...thanks...?
     
  4. wayne p

    wayne p Stunt Coordinator

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    I would define air as the perceived space between, or definition of, the various instruments or voices producing the specific piece of music. Room treatment and speaker placement go a long way here as does the ability of the hardware to cleanly and realistically reproduce the recording. Making a system/room too sterile however produces great air but not a musical result, IMHO.

    I would agree that you are unlikely to detect any audible difference between reasonably well constructed interconnects.

    Wayne
     
  5. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    paul, that's really what it comes down to. there's no magic in them interconnects. the little that might happen with an interconnect is that there might be a slight increase, decrease in the voltage going to your amp. the only thing that's going to result in is perhaps a tiny increase/decrease in the volume of your speakers. when people hear slight variations in volume, the interpretrations of that vary widely. once levels are matched, it's been found that people have been unable to successfully differentiate between them in controlled, unsighted testing.
    this is not to say that using one as opposed to another can't have an electrical effect. it's just that the electrical effect doesn't translate to issue of audibility, especially as you've stated. if one interconnect results in being flat out to 45k Hz and the other to 39k Hz, from the point of audibility, you just can't tell.
    i appreciate your desires to maximize and improve your system. this though is not the way to do it. provided this is what you're going to stick with then your improvements will lie in improving your speaker placements as well as working on your room.
    however if this answer is not to your liking you'll find a rabid bunch of believers over in the cable section of audioasylum. they will most certainly help you spend your money.
     
  6. Brett DiMichele

    Brett DiMichele Producer

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    I didn't like the air in my setup.. Too Laid Back... So I
    went on the iternet and bought a container of genuine florida
    canned air.

    My reasoning was that florida gets a lot of sun shine so
    thier air must be more "vibrant" or "forward" rather than
    my stale and cold Pennsylvanian air.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Lee-M

    Lee-M Stunt Coordinator

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    Gentlemen (and ladies?),

    I have found the impact from different interconnects to be solely dependant upon the connected components' susceptibility to the impact provided by said different cables.

    I can tell you, from my own limited component experience, combined with conversations with and reviews by higher-end users, that cables DO make a difference, but

    1. It depends on the synergy between the components (how many possible combinations of components do you think there are? It staggers the mind to conceive of it),

    2. A familiarity with the source material (and some better recordings will reveal these differences to a degree where the differences are audible and obvious), and

    3. Some listeners simply hear and care about these differences better and more than others.

    If an audiophile is someone who strives to create the impact of a live performance in their listening room, the equipment (including interconnects) in the upgrade path are going to change the sound. I have ABC auditioned three different cables on a home system that consisted of a McCormack TLC-1 preamp, McCormack DNA-1 power amp, and Klipsch Forte speakers, and I could hear the differences between all three interconnects. I found I was willing to pay that difference to obtain the sound I preferred. (I went with Nordost, BTW).

    To flatly state that, in your own limited experience, there is no difference other than volume between different interconnects is like saying that Bobby Fischer only played games, or like telling a wine connoisseur that all wine tastes like sour grapes.
     
  8. Michael Mohrmann

    Michael Mohrmann Screenwriter

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  9. Brian Fitterman

    Brian Fitterman Stunt Coordinator

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  10. Lee-M

    Lee-M Stunt Coordinator

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    Brian,

    Are you using the balanced connectors from your Anthem to your amplifier? If so, what cables are you using? I am using Nordost Solar Wind RCA's from my Anthem to my Rotel power amp, but am trying to decide on XLR interconnects...
     
  11. Brett DiMichele

    Brett DiMichele Producer

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    Okay let me get this straight.. The Believers in Cable Magic
    are allowed to believe and express their opinion but the Non
    Believers are not?

    Hmm...

    Take 2 high quality cables, input a signal.. If they don't
    come out the other end exactly the same, then there is a
    problem with the cable IMHO. The cable's job is nothing
    more than to pass a signal from one electrical component
    to another. Does a good cable make a difference over a junk
    one? Yep... Does a "Esoteric" cable make an audible difference
    than a good cable? If you perceive it to be so, then it is
    so.. (To you)

    There is room in the world for both camps and we can all
    poke good hearted fun at each other. If our skin is all so
    thin then we are in the wrong hobby! [​IMG]
     
  12. Paul Gere

    Paul Gere Second Unit

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    Thanks to all for the sentiments.
    I knew I was stepping into a very subjective issue with this post and got about what I expected in response. Thought I'd try the post here first so that I could communicate with folks who had the same equipment that I did. I'll try elsewhere and play with speaker positioning and room tuning.
    Thanks again.
     
  13. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    Well even wine experts get fooled Lee...read about it at this link: http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_564693.html
    All I can inform you is that once one assures that the levels to the speakers are matched and that you no longer know which cable you are listening to, the results of the studies have indicated that one's ability to differentiate one over another is reduced to the flipping of a coin. However, it's your gun, your bullet, your foot. AudioAsylum's the place to go if you want to discuss cables without fear of someone like myself making mention of what's been scientifically studied.
     
  14. Lee-M

    Lee-M Stunt Coordinator

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    Chu,

    Oooooh, the web's premiere (yeah, right) news site posts an uncredited story (no correspondent's names, no names of participants) about a whopping 56 wine tasters fooled into thinking red wine was white, and this proves your point?

    How about checking out theonion.com for more serious news stories... it's where I get all of my information.

    Any time someone belittles a subject about which they have an incomplete understanding, the proponents of the maligned idea can choose to try to make their point reasonably (which I think I have done), become vehemently defensive (which I try not to do), or shake their heads in resigned silence. I believe the time for silence has come. I learned years ago that closed minds are not for me to open, without said minds having the benefit of my own (or similar) experience.

    Paul, before I abandon this thread... If you would like to spend the money, I recommend you read a lot of reviews, and try some better interconnects. Your components and your ears deserve it.
     
  15. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    and here I thought you got it from mothraresearch...2+2 still equals 4 and sorry if repeating that makes me closed, but someday if you run across some credible listening tests i'd love to hear about them.
     
  16. Shane Martin

    Shane Martin Producer

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    It's pretty sad when someone wants a simple answer from people who use the product and all he gets is information he didn't ask for. None of the threadfarters here suggested an interconnect which he asked for.

    I don't expect the moderators to do a darn thing about this threadfart. It's just awful. [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Kimber PBJ's are good(to me) and I like them along with my current ones which are Tara Labs. Both I would suggest you try as you should be able to get those locally.
     
  17. Paul Gere

    Paul Gere Second Unit

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    Shane,
    Thanks for listening and for your suggestion.

    "Threadfart". pretty appropriate! [​IMG]
     
  18. Brett DiMichele

    Brett DiMichele Producer

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    I say buy the most expensive cables you can afford! The
    more they cost the better they will be. You will be happy,
    your ears will be happy and your equipment will be happy.

    And I will run my garbage interconnects on my junk gear
    because I am "close minded" and I just don't "understand".

    [​IMG]

    Good luck!
     
  19. Michael Mohrmann

    Michael Mohrmann Screenwriter

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  20. Paul Gere

    Paul Gere Second Unit

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    Geez, what a disappointing dogpile this thread has become. Guess I shouldn't have had such hopeful expectations.

    Please move along, nothing to see here.
     

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