Anyone have good experience with Adobe Premeire?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Scott Simonian, Nov 6, 2001.

  1. Scott Simonian

    Scott Simonian Screenwriter

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    Hi. I have been using Adobe Premeire for editing my movies for about a year now and I know my around ok.
    Recently, I purchased a shotgun mike for use in capturing "directional" dialouge. Er... just using its ability to BE directional for dialouge pickup only.
    Anyway, it seems to work be inverting the phase of the audio it is recording. I thought I had something backwards but nope, thats how it works. Anyone have experience with a shotgun mike? Do they do that?
    Well, I think I could remedy it by just inverting the phase in Premeire but I dont know what "audio" filter I use.
    Anyone know?
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  2. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

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    Scott,
    How can you tell the phase has been "reversed"? Specifically, for something to be out of phase, it must be out of phase with another signal- just curious what you are judging the polarity reverse against?
    Some microphones do polarity reverse, some cheap ones are just wired backwards. Also, whats the connector and how are you using it? If it's an XLR balanced and you're adapting it- it is possible you are reversing it with the adaptor.
    I have several "shotgun" mics (line gradient condensers)- they don't reverse phase of the incoming on axis signal by nature- but they do basically use phasing to reject sounds coming from off axis of the mic's pickup pattern.
    By the way, what does this have to do with premiere?
    Vince
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  3. Scott Simonian

    Scott Simonian Screenwriter

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    quote: How can you tell the phase has been "reversed"? Specifically, for something to be out of phase, it must be out of phase with another signal- just curious what you are judging the polarity reverse against?[/quote]
    Honestly, I dont know for sure. But what happened was kind of funny. After I had finished the final movie, I brought the movie into the theater for the MiniDV ->VHS converstion. I start the recording and (since I have my receiver defaulted to DPL) everything that was recorded with the mic had been coming exclusively from the surrounds. Now, tell me if Im wrong but doesnt anything that is to be encoded for DPL have the phase inverted to have the sound steered to the rear?
    quote: Also, whats the connector and how are you using it? If it's an XLR balanced and you're adapting it- it is possible you are reversing it with the adaptor.[/quote]
    YES. It is XLR based and I am using a cable that has a XLR terminator at one end and a 1/4inch "big headphone" jack at the other end. Not really an "adapter", could that be it?
    EDIT: I also have the 1/4inch going into a little 1/4 to 3mm "miniheadphoneplug" adapter. what about that?
    quote: By the way, what does this have to do with premiere?[/quote] I thought that the only way I could get rid of the problem would be to reverse the phase so it would be normal and I wanted to do it from Premeire.
    Hmmm....am I forgeting anything else?
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    [Edited last by Scott Simonian on November 06, 2001 at 07:30 PM]
     
  4. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

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    Although I have yet to do much work with direct pro logic encoding, I think the rear channels are 90 degrees out of phase to set for decoding.
    I would experiment a little... tell me more about your adaptation system. Is the XLR plug to 1/4 plug-- is the 1/4 plug a stereo plug (TRS, meaning it has a tip, ring and sleeve, like a stereo heaphone plug) or is it mono (TS, having just the tip and the sleeve, like a guitar cable)?
    How about the mini adaptor? Mono or stereo? How about the mic input, mono or stereo?
    -Vince
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  5. Scott Simonian

    Scott Simonian Screenwriter

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  6. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

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    The reason I thought 180 probably isn't... they are 180 out of phase, and someone watches it in downconverted mono- the 2 sounds would cancel one another and there wouldn't be any sound at all.
    Granted I could be wrong, in fact given your example I probably am...
    The adaptor issue is like this:
    --The microphone is XLR, that is balanced which means it is 3 conductors carrying Hot, Neutral, Ground.
    --The cable goes from XLR to 1/4 inch that you say is TRS (stereo type). TRS connector is also 3 conductor (A tip, a ring, and a sleeve-- normally used to carry 2 hots and a common ground for stereo headphones)... HOWEVER in this case it is getting a mono balanced signal: Hot, Neutral, Ground from the XLR mic.
    --Next you pass that to a 1/8th adaptor, also stereo. Once again, you are passing 3 signals- Hot, Neutral, Ground that originated from the mic.
    --Finally it is plugged into the camera. The camera plug is expecting a stereo signal: Channel one on the tip, Channel Two on the Ring and Ground on the sleeve. HOWEVER that isn't really what you're giving it. You're giving it a mono balanced line from the mic: Hot tip, Neutral Ring, Ground Sleeve.
    The neutral is simply the hot, 180 out of phase. So you've created a situation where the left channel and right channels are 180 out of phase, as you thought.
    I don't know if Premiere has a filter to fix that- but any program like Sound Forge could do it. I think they still have a free limited release of COOL EDIT and I'd bet it has an invert command.
    What I would do, for the future, is get a different mini 1/8 adaptor- get a mono one. The mono one will short the Neutral to ground, and will pass a single, in phase, hot to the camera. It will pass it mono, but you only have one mic- so it should be mono!
    Hope that Helps
    Vince
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    [Edited last by Vince Maskeeper on November 07, 2001 at 09:43 AM]
     
  7. Scott Simonian

    Scott Simonian Screenwriter

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    REALLY? Do you think that would work? That would be so cool, Id pick one up in a heart beat.
     
  8. Vince Maskeeper

    Vince Maskeeper Producer

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    Well, at some point in the signal chain you need to loose the neutral. Getting a different adaptor that isn't stereo, with cause the neutral to be essentially ignored- and it should solve the problem.
    -Vince
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  9. Scott Simonian

    Scott Simonian Screenwriter

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    Wow, thanks Vince. Ill pick a "mono" adapter sometime later this week. Ill let you know if it works. [​IMG]
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