Any users of the Outlaw ICBM? (1 Viewer)

[Joe Cole]

I just received my new ICBM and set it up over the weekend. I have a sony sacd player and am now wondering how I lived with out it. With proper base managment SACDs sound even better. Since I use my analog outs most often for CDs as well I am sure it will make a big difference there as well.

It is well worth the price if you have a SACD or DVD-A player. My Krell 7.1 does base management very good in the digital domain so I switch all the channels to by-pass for DVDs. I may try it any way to compare the two.

 

[Drew_W]

I heard that Outlaw was shipping with a free set of Cables also.

Is this still going on ?

 

[Joe Cole]

Not when I bought mine, last Monday.

 

[Chriss M]

In my experience, the ICBM did more harm than good in the system I tried integrating it into. I found the ICBM to suck the life out of the presentation as if you were looking through a dirty pair of sunglasses. IMO, "In this case" he was better off letting the pre/pro do a DSD-to-PCM conversion or running without BM than trying to adapt a sub $300 analog variable multichannel crossover. It's very easy to screw up the sound when you starting putting additional parts in a analog signal path. YMMV

Had i come across this thread 2 days ago, i would have said that i was very happy with the ICBM in my setup. However, after last night i have to say i agree with the above quote completely. I had recently become a bit disinterested in my setup and high end audio in general, as it seemed that no matter what i tried, i was unable to improve the sound of my system. There was a bit of harshness and sibilance that i could not seem to get rid of, and just a general "flatness" to the sound.

Then, last night on a whim, i decided to remove my ICBM from teh signal path and go straight from source>preamp>amp. (equipment is 222ES>anthem pre2>anthem amp2>vmps 626R) The difference was incredible. I had always heard people say that the ICBM is transparent to the signal, but this is definitely NOT the case for me.

 

[FeisalK]

bwahhh I want one :frowning:

 

[Brian L]

vmps 626R) The difference was incredible. I had always heard people say that the ICBM is transparent to the signal, but this is definitely NOT the case for me.

If that is the case, I would respectfully submit that either:

a. Your ICBM is broken
b. There is something set incorrectly WRT the ICBM and your system
c. There is a cabling problem
d. There is an output impedance/input impedance mismatch between you gear and the ICBM
e. You are prone to hyperbole

Seriously, the ICBM has been tested by mainstream publications and hi-end publications and found to be as near to transparent as a product can be. Subjective and objective evaluations have concluded that.

If you are hearing huge differences, then to quote the great southern philosopher Hank Hill; "Something Ain't Right".

And to paraphrase Peter Aczel of the Audio Critic, "There can be no effect without a cause".

No doubts that you are hearing something, but the reasons are yet to be known, IMHO.

BGL

 

[Doug_B]

Whether there's something wrong in Chriss' setup or not, there may be value in doing the experiment (if I have long enough interconnects ). One aspect that I know I'd have to take into account with my system is that the config with the ICBM delivers noticeably improved bass with 2 channel audio (duh!). What I mean is that the bass from my mains suffers at my listening position even more than what is typically explained away by not having the improvements of a sub. It's a really bad room interaction, so much so that I had to move the sub to the rear of the room, as generally any position for the sub in the front of the room did not work out. I also have my sub signal equalized, which further widens the disparity.

My point here is that my perception of mid and high freq performance of my mains will likely be skewed due to the diminishing of the bass output (and bass smoothness) without the ICBM/sub (and equalizer) combo. I may end up playing around with the sub level of the ICBM to get a better approximation of the non-ICBM config when doing the comparison, but I suspect I'll still need to apply some sort of fudge factor to my comparisons.

Doug

 

[Chriss M]

i'm actually still using the ICBM, it's just not filtering the signal going to my mains anymore. my preamp has 2 duplicate outputs, one of them goes directly to the amp and runs the speakers full-range. The 2nd output now goes to the ICBM , which is only hooked up to the sub. I'm crossing the sub in at 60hz and the natural rolloff of the 626R bass driver occurs somewhere a bit below that point. I took some simple measurements with the radio shack meter and there is a small hump in the 50-60hz area but nothing major. I'll probably smooth it out with the BFD at some point.

If i have time maybe i'll try a little experiment with returning the ICBM back in the signal path to confirm my initial findings. Although, understand, when i say there was an incredible difference when the ICBM was removed, that this is all relative. My system by no means sounded bad before. It actually sounded very good It was just that i had been tweaking and changing things, and nothing i did seemed to make much difference, until the ICBM was taken out. it was like it was masking out the finest details that the VMPS ribbons are able to provide.

 

[Doug_B]

my preamp has 2 duplicate outputs, one of them goes directly to the amp and runs the speakers full-range. The 2nd output now goes to the ICBM , which is only hooked up to the sub.

Thanks Chriss, excellent idea. A 2ch preamp is on my short list of upgrades; I'll make sure to get one with 2 outputs (the one I'm thinking of has the option). I can then take some measurements to see if I need to augment my BFD filters given that the mains will get a full range signal.

Doug

 

[Chriss M]

Thanks Chriss, excellent idea. A 2ch preamp is on my short list of upgrades; I'll make sure to get one with 2 outputs (the one I'm thinking of has the option). I can then take some measurements to see if I need to augment my BFD filters given that the mains will get a full range signal.

another good part of this setup is that the preamp also has an HT passthrough, so i can still use an 80hz crossover for movies when using the ht processor. Since the ICBM passes the "LFE input" unaltered, you can run full-range for 2-channel and a small/sub setup for HT without changing any settings.

 

[Doug_B]

Chriss,

My pre will have an HT bypass as well.

{Whoop-de-do, finally passed 1000 posts.}

Doug

 

[Chriss M]

Doug,

which one are you looking at ?

 

[Doug_B]

Chriss,

Considering the Odyssey Tempest, although I've recently been curious about the Van Alstine Transcendence line. I don't doubt that the Tempest would mate well with my Odyssey Stratos amp (a pre and amp should if from the same company), plus it's reported to have a level of smoothness that should complement my ribbons well. Also, I like giving Klaus at Odyssey my business; unbounded customer service. Worth a shot (after I get a modded universal player).

Doug