Another Blu ray audio question.

Discussion in 'Playback Devices' started by Camper, Mar 2, 2008.

  1. Camper

    Camper Supporting Actor

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    david dennis
    I'm am getting very close to buying a Blu ray player and have another audio hook-up question.

    First, I have a very nice older Denon receiver that has a 7.1 audio input, but no Dolby TrueHD or DTS HD MA built in.

    I'm going to buy the first Blu ray player that has 7.1 analog out and internal decoders for the new sound formats.

    3 questions:

    1. I gather that a soundtrack with 5.1 sound will produce no sound from my rear surround speakers via 'analog out.' Correct?

    2. I'm guessing that a 6.1 soundtrack with produce identical sound from both my rear surround speakers.

    3. I don't understand PCM at all since HD DVD didn't have any movies with that sound format (that I know of)
    So will the PCM soundtracks be available from the analog outputs of the new players?

    Thanks again to any folks who can help me with these questions!!
     
  2. Camper

    Camper Supporting Actor

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    I understand these weren't the most brilliant questions, BUT doesn't anybody know the answers to any of the questions?

    Thanks to anyone out there!
     
  3. sptrout

    sptrout Stunt Coordinator

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    I have a Denon 3300 and it only has one 5.1 analog input so I cannot help with your 6.1 & 7.1 questions other than than to ask if you know if there is a Blu-ray player with anything more than 5.1 analog out? I have a Samsung P1400 and it only has 5.1.

    As for PCM - - - Pulse Code Modulation (also called Linear PCM) tracks on Blu-ray disks are decoded and passed to the analog outputs like other digital formats (Dolby's True HD, DTS HD, DD, & DTS). Most Blu-ray players will not decode DTS HD-MA (only bit stream them via HDMI), so you and me are out-of-luck with that format except the player will decode the "core" track, which is very good. (Check the DTS web page for explanations of their HD formats.)

    All digital audio formats start out as PCM, so many believe that the PCM tracks will give you the best audio of all. But, this many vary some due to the different sampling rates used by PCM, Dolby, & DTS. Unless I know for sure, I always pick the PCM track, but it is highly likely that I would never be able to tell the difference between any one of the HD formats.

    The most difficult part of using analog out of a Blu-ray player (or even a DVD player for that matter) is getting the audio levels set correctly. I assume your Denon is like mine in that the analog input by-passes all surround processing including the Base Management System. This causes problems with setting the proper LFE channel level, and you cannot set speaker distances (not a big deal IMO). I also had a problem even getting the analog inputs to match the optical inputs (all 5.1 channels were exactly 4dB lower). Anyway, be prepared for level setting fun. I sometimes think it would be worth it to replace my 8-year old 3300 with a new AVR that has HDMI inputs, and all the new audio decoders. Maybe someday.....
     
  4. Camper

    Camper Supporting Actor

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    Thanks again sptrout!

    That's good info about the PCM and reassuring to me.

    My Denon 280? model has 7.1 inputs, so I'm set for the new Blu ray players that have 7.1 analog out.

    From all that I have read, the Sony BDP S550, will have 7.1 output AND an internal decoder for ALL audio formats DDTrueHD AND DTS HD MA!!!!

    So that is the model to buy.
    As soon as they release it, that is.

    If I can get a good price on a Samsung 1400, I'll get that one, since it has 5.1 outputs and an internal decoder for DDTrue HD at least.

    Thanks again.
     
  5. Keith I

    Keith I FoS

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    Hello. I did not want to create another thread so this subject line seemed appropriate. I changed the Title so that those who respond can keep the appropriate discussion in the right place. I also apologize if this answer is found somewhere else. I've looked but I haven't looked in the right place if that's the case.

    I do not have an HiDef-capable audio component with HDMI yet. I'm still using optical digital out from my BD player.

    I also do not have any BD titles that contain only HiDef audio with no Dolby Digital 5.1 or uncompressed PCM 5.1 (yet). I'm getting Gattaca and Speed this week. What audio format would an HiDef audio-only title default to on my system?
     
  6. John Dirk

    John Dirk Second Unit

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    If I am understanding your question correctly, you are basically asking what audio format your BD player will default to using an optical connection instead of HDMI. I believe the answer is DD 5.1 PCM. You should also be able to select DTS core if it's available on the BD title and your receiver supports it.

    John
     
  7. fernby

    fernby Extra

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    Thanks for that info, this is exactly what I needed to know!!

    I have an older Yamaha amp (Dolby 5.1 & DTS 5.1 audio only) and an SD Sony projector, and am looking to incorporate a BluRay player into my setup soon. I was wondering what the BluRay would downconvert the audio to through a bitstream/analogue output, and this appears to be an answer suitable to what I require!

    Thanks for your help!!!
     
  8. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    Not so fast. Thru a toslink/coaxial output connection it could default to Dolby Digital Plus and/or DTS High Resolution. These are a bit better than Dolby Digital and DTS but not nearly as good as Dolby TrueHD and DTS-MA.

    ouAs for the analog connection, do you mean the 7.1 channel analog outputs? If so, then you will get Dolby TrueHD/DTS-MA if your BR player internally decodes them and sends them out the 7.1 analog outputs. If you mean the red and white analog output then you won't get anything Dolby/DTS. You'll get plain old stereo.
     
  9. fernby

    fernby Extra

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    Thanks Gene, I think I got my terminology confused.

    What I MEANT was if I plug a BluRay player into my Dolby/DTS vanilla-only reciever, via the bitsream connection (optical or coaxial), what is the default audio format I should expect my BluRay player to put out via this connection? I have assumed that if I select bitstream out as part of the audio selection, will it send out a signal my reciever is capable of playing (ie, Dolby 5.1 or DTS). I don't have the funds yet to upgrade the reciever to an HDMI capable one (one lives in hope) so I am hoping that the HD audio can be converted down (by the player) to a format my reciever will decode. If I connect the 7.1 analogue outputs from the player direct to the amp (which only supports 5.1), I suspect I'll have to get the player to decode the audio down to suit my reciever. Does that sound like a scenario that could work?


    Currently, I am looking at the range of Sony players, if this makes any difference....
     
  10. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    Actually, it depends on what audio formats are on the particular disc you have inserted into the BR player. If your BR player is connected to your receiver with a toslink or coaxial digital cable then you could receive the almost never mentioned Dolby Digital Plus or DTS Hi Resolution audio format, if they are encoded on the disc. Otherwise, you will indeed receive plain old Dolby Digital or DTS. So, yes. Even if you select DTS Master Audio on the BR dics's setup menu the player will automatically down-convert the signal to DTS HR or DTS for output via toslink/coaxial.

    If you connect your receiver to a BR player with 7.1 analog cables and you buy a BR player that decodes the new TrueHD and MA formats and has 7.1 channel analog outs and sends that decoded signal out those 7.1's (like the Sony 560) then you will receive the new Dolby TrueHD and DTS-Master Audio formats.

    If your Yamaha only has 5.1 analog inputs (which most older receivers are equiped with) then go into the BR players speaker setup menu and select "None" for the Rear Surrounds. This will make it totally compatible with your Yamaha receiver.

    Sony's are fine BR players but so are Panasonic, LG, Pioneer, Samsung and a few others.
     
  11. fernby

    fernby Extra

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    Gene, many thanks for that! That clears up the confusion I had! Cheers for your time!
     
  12. JediFonger

    JediFonger Producer

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    i think this is the only unanswered question left:
    -if you play a BD movie w/5.1 u will only get 5.1 decoded by the player sent to your AVR, despite having a 7.1 connection. only on movies w/6.1 or 7.1 audio tracks will you get to use all 7.1. so that'll depend on the movie.

    the only way to truly utilize all 7 channels all@once is upgrade to a new AVR where u can enable DPLIIx or z on 5.1 to matrix 6.1 or 7.1 out.
     

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