A Few Words About A few words about...™ West Side Story -- in Blu-ray (1 Viewer)

[David Weicker]

I've now watched both of these - WSS and MFL. I have never seen either in a theatrical presentation (OK, I did see WSS while in college, but it wasn't in a proper theater - more of an outdoor, Valentine's Day showing).
I found WSS to be very good. I have ZERO problem with the blackout between overture and the main picture (note, this is only my own personal opinion - I realize others have stronger feelings about this, and that's OK. Personally, I don't like long overtures before, what is to me, the real movie). Having only seen this on TV or on prior home releases, it wasn't something I noticed. As for the few scenes that have been reported as 'less than stellar', they are not as bad as some people claim. To my eyes, they don't look worse than the prior DVD, in fact the do look better. It is only when contrasted to the non-dupe parts of the film that they are somewhat noticeable. The non-dupe part of the film look terrific. And these dupe scenes account for about a total 10-12 minutes out of a 2 1/2 hour movie.
I thoroughly enjoyed watching the current WSS.
As for MFL. While I wouldn't give it good marks, I didn't find it unwatchable. The flaws that were present on the prior releases - going back to the 'restored' LD are still there. They are just more visible on the Blu-Ray. I think it was a lazy release, but I'm not convinced that it could have been released without a lot of complainers. The tight shots and center of the picture look terrific. The edges have always been problematic and are just more noticeable on Blu-Ray. However, rereading RAH's comments, the only way to 'fix' the issues would be to heavily apply digital tools or use footage that wasn't used by the original restoration team. And based on other threads, that is as much a recipe for disaster (in HTF terms) as using an old master, which apparently this was.
David

 

[RapalloAV]

I have MFL on DVD and BD, the problem does not exist on the DVD copy copy I have, it is clean right to the outer edges. I have never watched the whole movie through to the end on BD as I cant stomach the look of it. An amazing film ruined on BD.
I saw MFL and WSS both in the very same 70MM cinemas when they were 1st released. On that BIG gently curved screen the image and colours were breathtaking, nothing today can replace those early 70MM images! Shot in 7MM and projected in 70MM

 

[Nick*Z]

My Fair Lady was never a problematic transfer until CBS did their painful transfer for the Blu-ray. I have the deluxe laserdisc set from the mid-90s and the Warner 2 disc deluxe DVD and neither look quite so bad. The color density issue on the blu-ray is baffling because the Harris/Katz restoration print was stellar and mint. What CBS needs to do (or preferably Warner's if they can get the rights back) is to rescan that original restoration print at 6 or 8k res and then go in - if necessary - and use their 'digital tools' to remove any minor dirt or scratches that may have been incurred since that restoration. But the color should NOT have faded since 1996!
A lot of classics have been given short shrift on Blu and that's a shame. I have to say, I really didn't care much for Olive's Buchaneer or A Double Life Blu-rays. But we'll see what Universal does with its delayed Hitchcock set. I'm also itching for Dial M for Murder from WB in two weeks. Just because it's old doesn't mean it isn't worth doing right. The sooner the studios figure this out the happier the rest of us will be.

 

[davidmatychuk]

I did tell the Fox Video lady during the phone call that they'd already sent a replacement disc, and that it was no different than the one I'd sent them, but this information didn't deter her from getting my mailing address to send me whatever disc they want so urgently to send me.

 

[Robin9]

The most disappointing blu-ray of a classic. I want this so badly in HD but will not purchase this mess.

So, how will you watch West Side Story? Or will you simply never see the film again?

 

[Moe Dickstein]

So, how will you watch West Side Story? Or will you simply never see the film again?

Theoretically people would keep their existing versions...

 

[Robin9]

Theoretically people would keep their existing versions...

Their existing versions will in most cases be the DVD. The DVD of West Side Story was one of the first I bought. The much despised BRD blows that DVD into the weeds! Anyone who rejects the BRD and sticks with the DVD is cutting off their nose to spite their face.

 

[Moe Dickstein]

Their existing versions will in most cases be the DVD. The DVD of West Side Story was one of the first I bought. The much despised BRD blows that DVD into the weeds! Anyone who rejects the BRD and sticks with the DVD is cutting off their nose to spite their face.

Isn't that their decision to make?
For you, the errors in the transfer and encoding of the film don't disrupt your enjoyment of the film, and so you can have a positive experience with the BD.
For some who place a priority on the integrity of what the creators of the work intended, a lower resolution, yet accurate representation of the film is superior.

 

[jseabough]

Speaking of MY FAIR LADY- I was so disappointed in the blu ray that I ordered a copy of the standard DVD set (with the great Peak illustration). I had given my old one way.

 

[JoshZ]

For some who place a priority on the integrity of what the creators of the work intended, a lower resolution, yet accurate representation of the film is superior.

I'm pretty sure the creators didn't intend their movie to be viewed from a low-resolution source that looks like crap on a big screen. If they had, they probably would have shot it in 16mm.

 

[Moe Dickstein]

I'm pretty sure the creators didn't intend their movie to be viewed from a low-resolution source that looks like crap on a big screen. If they had, they probably would have shot it in 16mm.

So then nobody should have owned VHS, Laserdisc or DVDs?
The point is, sometimes you have two bad options. A BD that in many ways looks great, but is in one or more crucial ways messed up, and an earlier format that is correct but lower res and looks worse on todays screens than it did in the past.
Each consumer needs to understand those choices, and decide what is best for them. What's wrong with that?

 

I bought the dvd collector's edition because they promised a great restoration. People who have bought these films over and over again are sick of falling for hyperbole when the final product contains the same errors. That's why I'm not buying it. It's not that I think the dvd is the end all be all, but I don't have the cash to spend on a flawed product again. The money I spent on the dvd is long gone. Fool me once, I guess.

 

[ijthompson]

I bought the dvd collector's edition because they promised a great restoration. People who have bought these films over and over again are sick of falling for hyperbole when the final product contains the same errors. That's why I'm not buying it. It's not that I think the dvd is the end all be all, but I don't have the cash to spend on a flawed product again. The money I spent on the dvd is long gone.  Fool me once, I guess.

I'm with you, Eric. The first blu mistake I could have forgiven, but the second? No way, Jose. Still standing here, with money in hand.

 

[James David Walley]

Quick question from someone new to the thread: At this point, I have no desire to put my money toward such a spectacular SNAFU by MGM, and will stick with the DVD. But, from reading upstream in this thread, I see mentioned that the Special Edition DVD (by which, I assume, you mean the two-disc set in the red slipcase) had a sync problem during "Tonight" that had each actor singing the other's lines. I went back and checked that chapter on my disc, and couldn't find any such problem. Sure, there were some cases where the voices didn't quite match the lip movements (not surprising in a duet where both voices are dubbed), but nothing that grossly called attention to itself. Am I looking in the right place, or are the sync problems found in a different chapter?

 

[Robin9]

Isn't that their decision to make?
For you, the errors in the transfer and encoding of the film don't disrupt your enjoyment of the film, and so you can have a positive experience with the BD.
For some who place a priority on the integrity of what the creators of the work intended, a lower resolution, yet accurate representation of the film is superior.

It's not a simple as that. The original DVD had considerable moiring, particularly during some of the dance routines. That was not an accurate representation of the film.
Obviously everyone has the right to choose how to spend their money. I was not disputing that.

 

[Moe Dickstein]

It's not a simple as that. The original DVD had considerable moiring, particularly during some of the dance routines. That was not an accurate representation of the film.
Obviously everyone has the right to choose how to spend their money. I was not disputing that.

So perhaps you go one back and stick with the Laserdisc (or VHS).
I'd say moire which is a technical issue with the format (though it can be mitigated by means which themselves affect the picture) is different from what was done with the transition out of the overture which is a mastering issue, not a limit of the format.

 

[Robin9]

So perhaps you go one back and stick with the Laserdisc (or VHS).

Why? Did they provide an accurate representation of the movie?
We can go round the houses all day on this but the inescapable reality is that for someone who loves West Side Story and who intends to watch it repeatedly over the years in their own home, this Blu-ray disc provides the best option. It is not perfect but very few BRDs are.

 

[Gary16]

We can go round the houses all day on this but the inescapable reality is that for someone who loves West Side Story and who intends to watch it repeatedly over the years in their own home, this Blu-ray disc provides the best option. It is not perfect but very few BRDs are.

+1

 

[Moe Dickstein]

Why? Did they provide an accurate representation of the movie?
We can go round the houses all day on this but the inescapable reality is that for someone who loves West Side Story and who intends to watch it repeatedly over the years in their own home, this Blu-ray disc provides the best option. It is not perfect but very few BRDs are.

In your opinion it is best. I'm satisfied with my Criterion LD.

 

[rsmithjr]

In your opinion it is best. I'm satisfied with my Criterion LD.

I compared the Criterion LD to the Blu-ray. Overall, it is absolutely no match to the Blu-ray.
It is interesting that the colors on the Saul Bass opening on the LD present some differences as well. There is a green there that people are saying does not belong.
I do however understand not replacing LD's. I have many titles that I have not purchased on DVD or Blu-ray for simply sentimental reasons.