A Few Words About A few words about...™ Howards End -- in Blu-ray (1 Viewer)

[PattyFraser]

Thanks Nick. And Sean, I thought you'd already said you weren't throwing out your HE BD disc, cause it works fine as a coaster.

 

[24fpssean]

I think the vodka stains will polish off.

 

[24fpssean]

I still resent having to buy a new player just for this one disc. Stupid and criminal. I'll wait until we know for sure if that's the problem... if we ever do.

 

[John Hodson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 24fpssean

I still resent having to buy a new player just for this one disc. Stupid and criminal. I'll wait until we know for sure if that's the problem... if we ever do.

I bought a multi-region modified Oppo simply to play Region A Criterion discs (when they announced Stagecoach; that was the moment...). It would have been an 83, but I retained my 983 for SD duties and went for the 80.


Blu-ray, for *all* manufacturers and authoring houses, seems to be one long ongoing beta test though doesn't it? Criterion aren't the only ones to fall foul of a standard that doesn't seem to have a standard!

 

[24fpssean]

It's as if we the consumer are being experimented on... wait, we are. DVD was so much easier. I've just read up and down reviews for Oppo and they have had problems, too. Not many, but like you say blu ray is just one unstandardized ordeal after another. And companies are still frightened of pouring billions into it with the Netfilx streaming video option spreading like a virus.


But most people, I think, favor tangibility, we like to hold the movie in our hands, read the liner notes and relish the ritual of setting it up for an evening's viewing experience. Streaming home video is for disposable entertainment, not for the classics. "Yes, Freddy, there is a right sort and a wrong sort!"

 

[John Hodson]

Not to go too far off track, but this is my third Oppo player (two SD, one BD), and I cannot recommend them enough. And yes, Sean, spot on; I love to hold the movie in my hands, suck in beautifully designed box art, read well-written sleeve notes or a booklet - it sets the juices flowing. A pox on downloading...

 

[24fpssean]

Hmmm, I may have to check out the Oppo...

 

[marsnkc]

Originally Posted by 24fpssean

Hmmm, I may have to check out the Oppo...

Google 'Lexicon Oppo' and you'll read about the scandal (broken by Audioholics) of Lexicon literally placing a complete Oppo BDP-83 (case and all!) into one of their own cases, naming it the Lexicon BD-30, and charging $3,500, apparently without modification, or at least any of significance. A $3,000 premium over the $500 price of the Oppo.

 

[marsnkc]

Anyone buying a region-free Oppo should be aware that, from what I've read on forums, a future firmware could cripple its region-free capability, though one company I know of claims that their mods are firmware-proof. Also, Oppo doesn't condone modifications (per BD Association rules), so any changes made could undermine their warranty.

I was afraid to take the risk, so for the time being I'll stick to my Oppo BDP-83 for region A BDs, my Oppo 983 for region-free playback of DVDs in my living room and my Oppo 980 in my bedroom.

 

[John Hodson]

I bought my Oppo from approved UK Oppo reseller CRT, who besides being utterly reliable, fit the modification before sale, and the unit is fully guaranteed and warranted by them. They also say that the multi-region modification simply cannot be disabled by firmware - the way it works, the hardware just doesn't come into the equation.

 

[ManW_TheUncool]

Originally Posted by John Hodson , who besides being utterly reliable, fit the modification before sale, and the unit is fully guaranteed and warranted by them. They also say that the multi-region modification simply cannot be disabled by firmware - the way it works, the hardware just doesn't come into the equation.

Good to know in case I ever decide to go for one. One thing good about BD so far (for those of us in North America anyway) is that (most of) the studios have been more lax about region locking their UK releases. That plus there are fewer regions for BD than for DVD w/ most of the East Asian countries being lumped into the same region as North America. Also, there isn't nearly the same concern about the NTSC-vs-PAL format issue (or similar) for BD (outside of the occasional extras being PAL formatted on some/few UK releases).


Incidentally, I was watching one of the HE extras the other night and noticed what might be the PAL speedup issue w/ some footages included in one of the documentaries. OR am I mistaken? If PAL speedup is really that bad, then I'm glad I haven't imported any PAL-formatted DVDs in the past. OR maybe it's some combo of PAL speedup plus whatever conversion Criterion used to include the footages into that documentary? Come to think of it, maybe Criterion just neglected to do a proper 3-2 pulldown processing for those footages and yielded a 24-to-30fps speedup instead...


_Man_

 

[24fpssean]

That featurette on HE is atrocious and shouldn't have been included if they couldn't get or convert to NTSC. Everyone sounds like they're on helium, at least in the film clip parts, and it isn't an interesting piece to begin with. The docs made for the disc, though, are wonderful! Would really love to see the deleted scene of the cat getting run over. Like James Ivory said, it's the only scene from the novel anyone remembers after a first read.

 

[marsnkc]

Originally Posted by John Hodson , who besides being utterly reliable, fit the modification before sale, and the unit is fully guaranteed and warranted by them. They also say that the multi-region modification simply cannot be disabled by firmware - the way it works, the hardware just doesn't come into the equation.

Thanks, John.


I presume then that some mods are software jobs and those are susceptible to firmware updates. It makes sense that a hardware mod would not be.

 

[John Hodson]

Originally Posted by Man-Fai Wong


Incidentally, I was watching one of the HE extras the other night and noticed what might be the PAL speedup issue w/ some footages included in one of the documentaries. OR am I mistaken? If PAL speedup is really that bad, then I'm glad I haven't imported any PAL-formatted DVDs in the past. OR maybe it's some combo of PAL speedup plus whatever conversion Criterion used to include the footages into that documentary? Come to think of it, maybe Criterion just neglected to do a proper 3-2 pulldown processing for those footages and yielded a 24-to-30fps speedup instead...


_Man_

I was brought up on PAL speed-up and usually I can't spot-it; but that's some speed-up. I don't know what the cause is frankly; it's certainly not common or garden PAL speed-up. It's a minor irritation though on an otherwise excellent package.

 

[marsnkc]

Originally Posted by Man-Fai Wong



Incidentally, I was watching one of the HE extras the other night and noticed what might be the PAL speedup issue w/ some footages included in one of the documentaries. OR am I mistaken? If PAL speedup is really that bad, then I'm glad I haven't imported any PAL-formatted DVDs in the past. OR maybe it's some combo of PAL speedup plus whatever conversion Criterion used to include the footages into that documentary? Come to think of it, maybe Criterion just neglected to do a proper 3-2 pulldown processing for those footages and yielded a 24-to-30fps speedup instead...


_Man_

Man-


I've got tons of imported Pal discs and would be hard pressed to notice the speed-up difference to NTSC. I'd imagine it's noticeable only on a computer comparison. Haven't watched the doc in question but that might be an anomaly or, as you say, a problem caused by Criterion's attempt to include the Pal section in an NTSC doc. (Just grabbing at straws. I feel like I'm way out of my league here!)

 

[24fpssean]

It's a 4% speed up. A Room With A View was mistakeningly released on DVD here in the US as a PAL to NTSC convert, with no pitch correction to the sound, so not only did everyone and the music sound an octave higher, the film ends about seven minutes sooner. The blu ray is correctly released from an NTSC master. These things happen in the underpaid world of home video.

 

[John Hodson]

That featurette is sped up by considerably more than 4% surely.

 

[Brandon Conway]

Originally Posted by 24fpssean

It's a 4% speed up. A Room With A View was mistakeningly released on DVD here in the US as a PAL to NTSC convert, with no pitch correction to the sound, so not only did everyone and the music sound an octave higher, the film ends about seven minutes sooner. The blu ray is correctly released from an NTSC master. These things happen in the underpaid world of home video.

Slight correction: the Blu-ray is from an HD master, which has the same runtime as a NTSC release.

 

[ManW_TheUncool]

Originally Posted by John Hodson

I was brought up on PAL speed-up and usually I can't spot-it; but that's some speed-up. I don't know what the cause is frankly; it's certainly not common or garden PAL speed-up. It's a minor irritation though on an otherwise excellent package.

Then probably someone at Criterion neglected to do a proper 3-2 pulldown conversion or similar for those footages, which I guess would yield a 20% speed-up (ie. 6 frames missing out of 30fps), not just the usual 4% PAL speed-up.


I could live w/ that for that sort of extras though it doesn't exactly look good for Criterion to have one more hiccup thrown in for this title.


_Man_

 

[marsnkc]

Originally Posted by Man-Fai Wong /forum/thread/294720/a-few-words-about-howards-end-in-blu-ray/120#post_3702126