$600 Subwoofer Shoot-Out: SVS PB1-ISD vs. Hsu STF-3 – Test & Review (1 Viewer)

[CurtisSC]

Edward....thanks for all the hard work!

By any chance...with all the testing you have done, have any SPL vs distortion numbers? ie...given a certain frequency, distortion numbers through the SPL range.

 

[Edward J M]

I'm not sure I understand your question, Curtis.

 

[CurtisSC]

take a given frequency, such as 40hz, the distorion measurements at 75dB, 85dB, 95dB....etc.

 

[Edward J M]

Oh, I see what you mean. No, nothing saved in a formal sense.

10% THD seems to be the popular number these days and I started down that road, so I stuck with it on this review. As you can see, the SPL can really get silly at the higher frequencies. 10% THD represents the maximum linear operating limits of the driver, where the suspension stiffness is about 4X that of resting, and the BL product falls to about 70%.

From what I have observed informally, THD tends to stay fairly low (around a few percent) even at pretty high volumes, and then THD rises suddenly above a given SPL. You can tell when the driver is being pushed to 10% on a sine wave - the tonal quality of it starts to obviously change, and this is especially noticeable at the higher test frequencies. Back off even few dB and it settles right back down and sounds a lot more comfortable and capable.

I may use 5% THD in the future for the upper test frequencies just to keep things sane around the house. A 120 dB blast at 40 Hz simply doesn't go over too well, even if it only lasts 3 seconds.

Regards,

Ed

 

[jan/m]

ed don't forget about us when a big magazine picks you up!

 

[Edward J M]

Are you kidding? You guys all rule. Sharing information, learning, raising the bar, and making friends - this is what it's all about. Thank God super high quality forums like HTF exist; it's just incredible what HTF has done for our hobby.

 

[terence]

I will co-sign on that comment! I love this forum and the members here are great, which breeds an incredible enviroment for all who love HT.

Home Theater Fourm A.K.A.

Home Theater Fun

 

[Craig Chase]

Guys relax... Do you know what those magazine reviewers make ?

Ed could not take the pay cut....

Ed - I asked you a question in Terence's "Movies that make" thread... Can we measure WOO HOO ! ...?

 

[terence]

I say Go 4 It!

 

[Edward J M]

Mega-ditto's Craig - none of us review gear for the pay - LOL! If that was the case, I'd be lying in the street gutter asking for handouts. It's a good thing we have "real" jobs and this stuff is just a serious hobby. You know what they say, the only difference between men and boys is the price of their toys. I look around the house and garage sometimes, and I have to agree. :b

No, you can't measure "woo hoo!", but you sure can feel it in your heart and soul. Time and time again, people state the biggest (by far) bang for the buck improvement they ever made in their music and HT systems was a quality subwoofer.

When your HT system transports you into the heart of the battle for Zion, and you forget you're listening to a subwoofer...well, moments like that are just pure magic.

 

[Allen Marshall]

Thanks to whoever posted to get this thign on the frontpage again or else i never would of read it.

That review kicked ass, so professional i felt double as inferior as i normally do on this site

Edward, terence, you guys are really nailin the truth here. If this site didnt exsist it would be awful, i would still have a red and white goin from the dvd player to the reciever and suppose i have dolby digital cause of the symbol on the reciever.

 

[ScottCHI]

dayng. that's purdy dayum deep. what church is that?

 

[Edward J M]

Saint Vodhanel Stimpson - you may have heard of it. I attend mass regularly and sit in section P, row B, seat 2U.

 

[Robb Roy]

Ed,

It *must* be magic -- that's my seat, too!

-Robb

 

[SVS-Ron]

Ed,

Thanks Ed. Awesome job. The fact you stuck through debugging with such methodical pursuit was impressive.

We strive to build the best and it's a special treat for us all at SVS when someone puts us up against some of the best competition with such comittment to objective honesty.

While it's nice to come out on top in reviews like this, it's even better to know customers of various brands show such a passion for excellence in what many consider a budget price point.

All the best. Looking forward to your PB2-Ultra review. That should be an eye (and ear) opener given such a thorough test protocol.

Ron

 

[Craig Chase]

Ed - I finally have something where I cannot agree with you... "Saint" and "Vodhanel" in the same title ?

That is more than I can accept as reasonable...

 

[Edward J M]

A heartfelt thanks, Ron. Getting the test rig to generate truly accurate data both from an absolute and a relative stand point was very challenging, but totally worth it. If the test data doesn't stand up to independent scrutiny, it's worthless.

These might be the "budget" offerings from SVS and Hsu, but $600 is a lot of beans to some people, and they want to know what their money is buying. For internet direct purchases, owner feedback and consumer reviews on great forums like HTF are really the only way for prospective buyers to get solid information before they take the plunge. And internet consumers are a pretty savvy bunch that need a bit more convincing than "it's a great sub, trust me".

Craig, are you saying that since Tom Vodhanel has created subwoofers that have been characterized as "wicked", and "pure evil", that he can't possibly be associated with the word Saint?

 

[Craig Chase]

Ed - Something like that... Their subwoofers are way too much fun to make me think of Saints making them.

And anyone calling them "pure evil" must own Bose...

Well, My mother-in-law did call the PB2+ evil during Lord of the Rings...

 

[Cam McFarland]

Obviously alot of time & effort went into this & thanks.

But I found a possible flaw....






I dont know if this would affect the outcome of any of the tests you performed, but the instruction manual that came with my HSU states:

"Not to be used on hard surface....designed to be placed
on carpet, etc." obviously this is not verbatim, but
something to be figured in.


So if indeed you did play the HSU on your hardwood floor (please ecuse me if I missed you stating otherwise)I would think it would change the score of at least the first test
of the "spreaker to floor interface". There would be no "vibrating or buzzing" at higher volume if properly
used per the owners manual.


just curious is all.....

- Cam

 

[Edward J M]

Hi Cam:

Yes, I did experience buzzing and sub wandering on the laminate floor, so I installed some rubber furniture cups underneath the spiked plastic feet to de-couple the STF-3 from the floor. Worked like a charm, and totally stopped the bad vibes and the wandering.

To be as fair, I tested the STF-3 with the rubber furniture cups installed. Otherwise the loud buzzing would have definitely contributed to the amplitude of certain harmonics on the THD testing at the higher frequencies.

I suppose a piece of carpeting would have accomplished the same thing, but at the expense of aesthetics. The cups looked much nicer (the black small ones are hardly obtrusive) and is a good solution for owners who either lack carpeting or don't like the look of a throw rug below the sub.

Also, if you have a thick shag carpet, it is certainly possible the spiked feet could sink down deep enough to cause some serious woofer clearance problems.

All things considered, the baseplate on the PB1 with the stock low profile feet and the optional/included 3M compliant rubber cup feet is definitely a superior floor interface solution. It provides a consistent woofer firing surface and excursion clearance regardless of floor covering, and the rubber cups can be used on slippery smooth surfaces like laminate. Just don't install them until you've selected the final sub location because they sure are grippy!

And another update on the STF-3. The new owner reports the vinyl wrap has bubbled and is delaminating on a side wall near the top cap. Nothing really bad looking (the bubble is about the size of a quarter), but we'll be keeping an eye on how the vinyl wrap holds up over the long term.

Regards,

Ed